I read in one Whirlpool forum discussion today on the average graduate computer programmer salary comparison between Australia and US. The median expected salary for a typical Programmer I in Los Angeles is around USD$51,708 as of June 2003, which converts to AUD$78,345. At the same time, the same graduate position will only bring you around $39k before tax in Sydney Australia. Interestingly that teaching jobs at schools pay about the same in Australia and in US. And in Australia you can get a casual rate of AUD$15.50 per hour working in the McDonald’s, where as you probably can only get paid USD$3 per hour on the other side of the Pacific Ocean.
So the question is, is it fair? I guess for many IT workers, it is easy to say no, it is not fair. It can be very tempting to move to US or UK to work. You earn two or three times more overseas doing te same work, and you can laugh all the way to the bank when you return home to Australia with all your savings. You complained that your skill set should qualify you with a much higher pay, but small economy and heavy taxation system seems to have buried many IT elites in Australia…
But what would you feel if you are one of these Maccas workers in the picture. Your work does not require any qualification, but you can still make decent money because your salary is protected by the trading unions. I wonder sometimes, isn’t Australia a wonderful country? You go and spend your day at work, and you will be sure to receive enough for your living (provided you don’t spend all of them on drugs, of course). You don’t have to worry whether your 3 bucks an hour wage can even cover your rent. You work, and you get what you deserved. It is a fair country.
Sometimes I might feel jealous of how much a software developer can get paid in the Bay Area, but I also felt sorry for many in US who worked day and night but still cannot survive. It is not just in the states, but in many Asian countries, the rich just keeps on getting richer, and poor gets nothing at the end. Even in Australia, sometimes you don’t get paid what you have deserved if you work for a Chinese company (or has a Chinese boss). This has happened to a few friends in MBF, and it is just sad to see how Asians squeeze blood out from poorer Asians in a western country like Australia :(
Scott, The grass often looks greener on the other side. I’m in Canada and the allure of the US is even closer. Don’t be blinded by the money. In the Bay area in order to find someplace affordable to live you will have to commute for 2 to 2 1/2 hours every day. Lots of other issues have an effect on how much money you REALLY have. Someone in IT in Indiana or Ohio won’t get much more then you in AU. Lots of people stay in those states because they know better then to be lured by the big bucks. Lots of people in Canada have been lured there but most of the ones I know have returned.
Skip,
Yes I agree with you. Canada is definitely facing a greater temptation than Australia. Both my cousins in Canada are now working in New York. Where at the same time I reckon Canada has a better social structure, a better society to live in.
And that was the point for my blog. Quite often people look into their own interest by seeking the best benefit they can get (very typical capitalism). In the end as it widen the differences between the rich and poor, it creates instability in the society as those who are less fortunate amongst us, who put in the same effort, do not get what they deserve.
Having lived in Australia for a while I can say it’s possibly the most egalitarian society there is. It’s the best of both worlds and on top of that living cost is low if you do not live in the few expensive places. Compared to Europe you spend almost nothing on heating, taxes, cheaper to build houses(no heatinginstallation or double glass windows,no heavy insulation), winterclothes, fuelcost is lower too. In the end you have more money to spend
Good call on being fair with wages. As the gap increases between the Haves and the have nots there is only going to be an increase in social decay. As a friend of mine once said “If I don’t have enough money to buy food I’m just going to rob someone.”. Is that the sort of world anyone would choose? Anyway its not how much you earn that is important it is the quality of life that is paramount. You could earn a lot of moolah in the Mid-east but would you want to?
Great site
This may be quite off-topic, but very interesting nonetheless. I’ve read a wonderful book published free online as a series of chapters. This story, written by Marshall Brain of howstuffworks.com fame, presents an optimistic view of a future with robots! It takes place in Australia (!) and considers the possibility of an incredibly egalitarian society where humans are free to explore their creative impulses. This is starting to sound like an ad, but I really enjoyed the story and maybe you will give at least chapter 1 a test run.
http://www.marshallbrain.com/manna1.htm
i think that living in austraolia would be better than living in the usa because it very cheap to live there
I’m a 30 year old dual citizen of the USA and Australia who has worked as a software engineer in San Francisco, and is now working for CommSec in Australia. I’m taking a small pay cut to move back to Oz, but I feel it’s worth it. If you are a career-oriented person and just want to work or study hard, make lots of money, get good job experience and retire early, then the USA is the place for you. If you would rather have fun in life while you are young, makes heaps of friends, play a lot more sports and outdoors activities and not care what your neighbours think of you, then Australia’s the place for you. Australia’s education and healthcare systems are of a higher quality than that of the USA (I have studied and been treated by both – first year of university studies in the USA is the equivalent level of education as grade 12 in Australia), but you have less job options in Australia than you do the USA. As a result, I think Australian society is less fussy, more friendly and more tolerant than the USA is. There are also about 280 million more people in the USA than Australia, and that means that there are a lot more political groups and factions to deal with. In San Francisco there’s hundreds of homeless people parading around the streets, vomiting and excrementing everywhere and harassing the public. In Sydney I’ve only seen about 4 homeless people so far… that alone gives you some sort of perspective about the inequality that modern day USA is facing. It’s a little more depressing environment. Also do not forget that Americans own a lot of guns, and shootings are much more rampant in the USA than in Australia. While studying in the USA I was shocked to see the “no firearms” signs on University library doors there. I have also found that Americans are also more secular and less willing to explore different environments or meet new friends, sticking to their “own kind” and not being as socially outgoing, adventurous or well-travelled as Australians are. I think this is due to the fear and paranoia that the current US federal government is promoting, more specifically. Personally I’d rather have smarter, healthier, less jealous friends around me than the backstabbers and asskissers that the USA produces. Sorry, but that’s my biased opinion after spending my life travelling between the two countries.
I’ve recently received my Australian Permanent Residence status and am contemplating to move to Australia in the near future with my wife. I’m really curious to find out how much I need to make each month to live comfortably in either Sydney or Melbourne. When we move to Australia I’ll be the sole bread-winner in the family. I’m uncertain if I’ll ever make enough money to support my family and still be able to enjoy good quality life in Australia.
Hi,
Same is the case with me. I am an Indian working for an IT company as a Business Manager and looking forward to move to Australia. I am not sure what challenges does Australia offers me in IT. Moreover I am planning to move with my wife. I would appreciate if anyone can tell me what kind of earnings should I be making to take care of my expenses.
Rahul.